Welcome to our new Rocket Fuel blog, featuring EOS Worldwide Visionary Mark O’Donnell and Integrator Kelly Knight. We’re continuing to offer behind-the-scenes looks at EOS Leadership Team decisions, now focusing more tightly on the Visionary-Integrator (V/I) relationship. As we continue to preach the value of transparency, we’re also “walking the walk” by showing how EOS deals with many of the same challenges that our clients face.
For this introductory first episode, we asked Kelly and Mark to talk about their unique V/I dynamic and offer some practical tips to help other V/I Duos™ achieve Rocket Fuel in their organizations. Here’s what they had to say:
Since you two are the Visionary and Integrator™ at the company that invented those terms, you must be perfect, right? : )
Kelly: Mark says his clients think we’re the epitome of how EOS should be done.
Mark: They imagine we are!
Kelly: Right, but we have the same people issues, the same processes that get broken, and we’re very imperfect. So I try at every turn to say how imperfect we are, because some clients think we’re the shining example, and we’re not sometimes!
Switch roles for a second. Kelly, what makes a great Visionary? And Mark, what makes a great Integrator?
Kelly: A great Visionary needs to be open, and then cascade and communicate their vision really clearly so everyone else can understand it. And you have to have grit. What we do isn’t roses, rainbows, and lollipops. You have to roll up your sleeves and do whatever’s needed to move the organization forward. Mark is a great Visionary because he’s completely core values-aligned and seeks to serve the greater good of our community and team. And he’s never outworked.
Mark: Dan Sullivan talks about “make it up, make it real, make it reoccur.” A great Integrator is a great manager and leader. They hold people accountable and have hard conversations. Kelly being “Grow or Die” is unique for an Integrator. A lot of Integrators are high fact-finders. They’re looking to stabilize a world that Visionaries are making unstable. A great Integrator like Kelly makes sure that the checks are cashed that the Visionary’s mouth writes. She allows an out-there-thinker Visionary like me to sleep at night and know that everything is handled.
What advice do you have for other Visionaries and Integrators on how to stay connected and productive?
Kelly: “Know Thyself” is something Gino talks about in The EOS Life. First, a Visionary needs to know that they’re really a Visionary and an Integrator an Integrator. I wouldn’t be the right Integrator for just any Visionary, and Mark wouldn’t be the right Visionary for any Integrator. Until you take an assessment, you don’t really know. I would suggest reading Rocket Fuel and taking the Crystallizer Assessment. Mark and I are also really disciplined about Clarity Breaks™ and having our Same Page Meetings™. Every Monday, we have 90 minutes together. Then once a month, we have a 4-hour stretch of time together where we can do deeper thinking.
Mark: A company moving and growing as fast as we are, that’s why we take the amount of time we take. I think out loud. If I did that in front of the entire team, it would create total organizational whiplash. Same Page Meetings are essential to having those conversations, deciding what the team should be aware of and how to prioritize. Everyone should read Make the Noise Go Away by Larry G. Linne, which is a more emotional addressing of the V/I Duo. Being a member of Strategic Coach is also one of the best things a Visionary can do. Kelly and I are both in it.
Are there any myths about the Visionary and Integrator roles?
Kelly: One is that Integrators don’t have any ideas or don’t have any good ideas — that we just receive great ideas and go execute on them, but we couldn’t possibly be the genesis of a great idea. That’s not true.
Mark: Visionaries who haven’t had a great Integrator might think that. The myth of Visionaries is that they always “come down from the mountain” with their ideas. I’m not that kind of Visionary. I’m more like, “What do you think of this? Here’s an idea to add to that one.” And Kelly and I kind of play tennis, and momentum builds. There’s also a myth that the Integrator is a wet blanket. Sometimes it’s true, but that’s part of the role. It’s not Debbie Downer. If you respect the role, that’s not the case.
What are some specific challenges that you’ve dealt with as a Visionary-Integrator team, and what can other people learn from those challenges?
Kelly: The acceleration of EOS One™ is a good example. That’s something that would make most Integrators super uncomfortable. EOS software is going to serve both Implementers and end-user clients, and we’ve been marching forward to launch in September. But Mark decided that we should move it up to March 1. I started asking questions: Do we have the readiness to do it? Is the tech team ready to do it? A Visionary sometimes needs to sell themself on an idea. Once Mark does that, he shares it with me and only me, and we have a conversation about it. If we both feel good about it, we take it to the Level 10 Meeting™ and share it with the team.
Mark: The point of me selling myself on some ideas first is that you have to acknowledge that you’re going to cause stress. I think about the stress I’m about to cause Kelly, and how that’s going to play out in her house, with her family. Then I think about the team, the work it’s going to cause them. In my less enlightened past, I would have just gone to the team with it, and some of them would have had heart attacks. Now I put it through an Impact Filter, which is a Strategic Coach tool, and maybe 1 out of 5 of those make it to Kelly.
Kelly: Whatever the process is, I know that Mark is always thinking about the V/TO™ Front Page, our Core Values, Core Focus™, Core Target™, our Marketing Strategy, 3-Year Picture™.
Mark: I look at the front of the V/TO and ask, “Does this get us closer to executing on our vision? Does it help entrepreneurs live their ideal life through our Niche or training toward EOS Mastery? Does it get one more entrepreneur running on EOS so they can live their ideal life?”
Inevitably, some tension will emerge in the V/I relationship. What’s your advice to other V/I teams on how to deal with that?
Mark: Strengths Finder has their 34 strengths, and Kelly and I both have “Learner” in our Top 5. That helps a lot, because if one of us weren’t a Learner, we wouldn’t be a great fit. Remember that a plane can’t take off unless there’s friction. There’s no lift without friction. We call it Rocket Fuel because there’s lift. Tension can be really healthy or really destructive. I know what Kelly’s unique ability is, and I respect it. Because of that, it’s a positive tension.
Kelly: It’s a work marriage. You have to want it to be great, and that’s a huge commitment. Being vulnerable, open, honest, it’s super hard. Just stick with it. If we’re servant-leaders, then when things get hard, that’s when you go back to serving the greater good, which is in the V/TO.
Dive into what it takes to be a more effective Visionary/Integrator duo. Take our Rocket Fuel Assessments to Crystalize, Connect, and Maximize your V/I Relationship.
YOUR PRIVACY CHOICES